Maybe the explanation is elsewhere : although the MSX1 is a standard, there could be some differences between machines (and I don't speak here about the VDP).

You have mentioned Sony machines. On some of his models, Sony has not always respected all the specifications of the standard. It's true for some MSX2 that have slot 0 expanded (in place of slot 3 as it is the case on Philips MSX2), it could be true also for some MSX1 (the HB-75 has an intern database, if I don't get me wrong ... the internal software could be source of problems)

Also tested with a Philips VG8020, the most simple yet compatible MSX system: the full screen high-definition effects only work partially (first third of the screen). SVI-738 works fine.

But as you point, it may be a totally different issue.

too bad those demos require 64K on MSX1... I have Yamaha CX5-M with 32K, so I can't load MSX-DOS 1.x...

dhua

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I am interested for sure. But I have a very clear vision as to what I want to acheive in my MSX SDK: - all source in C# language (for .Net framework on Windows and Mono on Linux/Unix) - reuse #developer as ide (it's very flexible in extending features, and is working on Mono under Linux already) - hyperfast compilation time due to no external calls! - full compatibility with M80/L80 with HiSoft GEN80 extensions - custom 16 or 32K flashable ROM image to get quick communications with MSX via serial and/or parallel port to test stuff on real hardware I think you prefer C, and I quit C two years ago and moved to C#. C is great, but too much time is spent on debugging buffer overflows and boundary mis-hits... C# compiller detects those on compile time and not in run time... Very good for overall quality of code. But who cares what tools we use as long as they are source level compartible? I mean is the same ASM project can be compiled in both devkits, then isn't it great?

I are interested in your goals, maybe you can see more far, and to join a team for some develops under my proyect.

Actually i got a assembler programming enviroment but for MSX-BIOS, msx2, i written this on 1993 or something like that.... after finish the final version of the MNBIOS, and some drivers for IDE sunrise, i planning get my old notes about that, and port it to MNBIOS adding a lot of features ofcourse... this develop can to compile a 16k (final compiled code), in 9min on 3.58 mhz-.

But, i are far of #C, a time ago i ask for programmers for do things like that...

If you really want to join a serious proyect send me a e-mail. check for my mail at my website.

Well, we'll cooperate for sure if there is a way to do so

Dhau, you havenot the knowledge of the fact how many people in spain have a moonsound as well as many ide's , cf-cartridges ( original idea from Japan) so be careful with saying you know sonething about that.
Japan have 50 moonsounds and a least 30 GFX

Sunrise, I didn't mean to offend you!

All I say is that a lot of MSX-1 users out there are ignored because they don't have high-end devices. That is all.

Ideal new development should be like this:

First develop MSX1 version, free of charge.

Then develop MSX2/GFX9000/Moonsound version with better graphics and sound, and sell it with Sunrise help.

This way MSX1 users (Brazil) is not discriminated just because they don't have money for bleeding edge MSX technology. And bleeding edge folks still feel superriority due to better graphics and sound, so they pay money to SunRise and developer, because they are rich and can afford it.

Am I right?

With my skills i can do a faster BASIC interpreter, but is not my priority.

MY proyect still need a lot of work, but is more advanced and more useful, why? because this is not only for ppl that got a GFX9000, the minimun is a msx2 with mapped RAM 128k as minimun.

Look at my web site, download the docs, and see the features....

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Ideal new development should be like this: First develop MSX1 version, free of charge. Am I right?

Are you referring to hardware. Hardware can never be free , the software perhaps .
And what kind of hardware you are referring to. If you refer to Ide I advise you to read all former msx-forum piosts on it first. We have plans and putted ideas already on a row.
Only the execution is in the hands of someone Jon de Schrijder. !
Also on other developments you and also Pitpan donot read other topics that have already been discussed widely.
A msx-1 is thus the same almost as executed by ese from japan.
So the knowledge and execution is already done. Also Brazil has its own msx1 in pld cause mauel del poz has already made something like this.
So you can not offend me no way, but I simply conclude that you come with the same items over and over again. So that it looks more like frequent ask questions than a forum-topic and I must protest to the suggestion as if the netherlands is the one who is apart from the rest of the world. Because that is what you suggest
And that is totaaly wrong. Besides Moonsound and GFX , if you want to produce it on a larger scale than 25 is only for Moonsound valid and gfx cannot even be produced.
So the option for that a later on for moonsound is that you put in in A Fpga.
If you want to do that be my guest

To make something available and payable in countries who cannot pay it perhaps you can take in consideration to setup something like an oem-system.
But I believe people have the most strange expections from a few people -even less than MRC - to fulfill the things people would like to see for a price who is reasonable and certainly not overdue namely a small foundation
Nothing more nothing less

No, wait sunrise you are wrong... you not understand the Reply... he are talking about create a software version for msx1, and then support functions for the GFX9000+IDE + moonsound... here we are NOT talking about create hardware.

Ans since my time is much more precious for put my hands in a proto-board , and my first priority is MNBIOS, i not will arm my own hardware (made in home) as i can if i want to spend my time in that, but, i are waiting LPADIAL motherboard, and to buy a original IDE sunrise....

A time ago i ask for the price plus shipt ment on your website forum (i think 2 weeks ago) , and my post was erased.... so i think you are pissed off with me. And surely i know why...

But, of somework i not can scape, "to do the sunrise IDE drivers for MNBIOS", i need do that always, and is a lot faster if i can test using the original hardware. In my home. With my MSX.

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With my skills i can do a faster BASIC interpreter, but is not my priority.

Then define clearly your priorities, Fly.

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MY proyect still need a lot of work, but is more advanced and more useful, why? because this is not only for ppl that got a GFX9000, the minimun is a msx2 with mapped RAM 128k as minimun.

I cannot understand this. Dhau was talking about a SDK and now we are talking about hardware? Software?

Anyway, Fly, your conclusion is not valid. If you want to spread it, then code for MSX1 with 8 KB of RAM and more people will be able to use it.
Again, I do not know why your project (an OS for MSX2) is "more interesting" than dhau's one (an MSX SDK for Windows/Linux). They are completely different, and a good MSX SDK would be great for FlyOS and for *ANY* MSX development.

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Look at my web site, download the docs, and see the features....

That's pure marketing: if you want him to join you, then is up to you to convince him.



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I think SunRise is upset because my plans on hardware side. I ordered equipment and books to study FPGA/CPLD development. Also I suggested that the reson for low amount of MoonSound cards sold (~450 units) is the high price. I also told that I don't think that SunRise is making this price unfairly, because OPL chip is very rare and obscure for 2004. What I suggested is that if a good new hardware appears, and it's priced very moderately (i.e. up to 30 US$), it will be much more spreaded then existing high-cost solutions (GFX9000 and MoonSound).

But in this forum we are speaking about development on new games for low-end and high-end MSX systems.

And there are two tendencies:

- pitpan and I beleive in reaching the masses by having very indiscriminatory hardware pre-requisites;

- Grauw and his team believe in MSX2 + all the greatest periferials (GFX9000, MoonSound and IDE)

It is not related to new hardware development at all...

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I are interested in your goals, maybe you can see more far, and to join a team for some develops under my proyect. Actually i got a assembler programming enviroment but for MSX-BIOS, msx2, i written this on 1993 or something like that.... after finish the final version of the MNBIOS, and some drivers for IDE sunrise, i planning get my old notes about that, and port it to MNBIOS adding a lot of features ofcourse... this develop can to compile a 16k (final compiled code), in 9min on 3.58 mhz-.

16 KB in 9 minutes? That too slow even for an MSX at 3,5 MHz. 9 minutes x 60 seconds = 540 seconds. Then 16384 bytes / 540 seconds = more or less 32 bytes/second. So, if you decided to assemble, let's say, Metal Gear 2, it will take more or less 9 minutes x 512 KB / 16 KB = 9 minutes x 32 = 288 minutes = about 5 hours of CPU time.

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If you really want to join a serious proyect send me a e-mail. check for my mail at my website.

So, the conclusion is that dhau's project is not serious?

Note that Guru Logic will be for a plain MSX2 with 64kB of RAM and FM-Pac. So nothing particularly fancy...

~Grauw