After the huge success of similar threads on fMSX/S60, Meridian and Vscreen: this is the threads where you can post all your suggestions and comments on Polka, the latest tool from Wolf_.

here's a todo-list already:

- a "new"-button ^^;
- a sketch/macro editor to place tiles next to eachother, to see whether they match
- more RMB functionality for the 'tiles'
- "clear pattern" button (that's like the Reset button, but then without the color stuff)
- save/load parts of the tiles-section (you know, draw a canon, and save just the canon, so you can load the same canon into the new gfx set of world 2)

Very cool tool Mr Wolfy dude

This is the kind of tool that was really missing !

Since it's written in Blitz just like the Vscreen Level Editor, it would be cool to have some inter-connection between both tools, file format wise.

What is the format of those PPR files ?

A nice addition would also be the loading and conversion of SC5 gfx

and don't forget .BMP!

Maggoo, let's do the email-way instead..

About sc5/bmp-conversion.. the whole concept of this type of editor was to have tools to make you work -and think- within the limits of sc2/4 ..
I haven't planned any real conversion yet, I rather use something else which I already tried last year with my own hacky-sc4-editor, which is: using reference images and then reproduce them yourself. The unused part of thescreen down-right is reserved for that.

Accept .MIF format ? MIF also know as MSX Interchange Format.
It's be great too if accept to save at this format.

I don't see any benefits in MIF tho (I base my opinion on info from the msx faq).. to me MIF is more a format for real images, rather than tiles using pattern-mode. The MSX faq states that MIF is done for msx2/2+/g9k .. well, Polka is pretty much meant for MSX1, since screen 4 is identical to screen 2 except for the sprites..

Different formats for palettes etc. could be an issue.. however, when saving a palette from Polka: 'raw' is how it's stored in vram, 'asm' is a nice line with dw stuff, and 'bas' is a matter of merging. *If* I make a 'load palette' button in a next update, then I'll require 'raw' vram-style palettes, 32bytes..

So.. uhm.. sorry, but MIF is not on the todo list unless someone gives me a *real* good reason.. Keep in mind it's crosss-developing we're talking here.. several benefits of MIF -I've nothing against MIF by itself- are relevant for generic MSX-usage with bitmap images, but not really at this place.

MIF isn't PD either, so scratch that...

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Different formats for palettes etc. could be an issue.. however, when saving a palette from Polka: 'raw' is how it's stored in vram, 'asm' is a nice line with dw stuff, and 'bas' is a matter of merging. *If* I make a 'load palette' button in a next update, then I'll require 'raw' vram-style palettes, 32bytes..

Wolf_ you application is very cool -I'll surely use it-. One thing is that I don't get the way to make these BASIC and ASM exports... it's necesary to fill the entire tile block to export in other format than ppr?. Or I'm doing something in the wrong way?.

For the moment I'll suggest BMP import, beacuse with that tool you merge all the posibilities of any image editor with Polka. Any way is a great tool, perhaps a little blocky (talkin' about the design of the window), but very usefull... and the scroll up/down, flip h, flip v and rotation tools are cool!, and the ASM export too!!

For now, I'll test it for a game I'm designing right now. If any bug is found i'll report it. For the moment, congrats Wolf_ for your contributioon!!!

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One thing is that I don't get the way to make these BASIC and ASM exports... it's necesary to fill the entire tile block to export in other format than ppr?. Or I'm doing something in the wrong way?.

I don't see the issue here ..? o_O
You can always save patterns, palettes and colortables in raw, asm or basic (==raw + header) .. and if you didn't design something yet, then you get a bunch o' zeros

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For the moment I'll suggest BMP import, beacuse with that tool you merge all the posibilities of any image editor with Polka.

And is that BMP prepared for the sc2/4 limits? Or do you expect to load any BMP, and try to get the best conversion/reduction out of it? Like I wrote above in another reply, the tool was made to let you draw and think in the whole sc2/4 culture. If people want bmp/sc5 converters then I wonder if people are interested in a 'drawing tool' anyway..! Why not simply make a converter and let everyone draw in Photoshop instead? Personally I couldn't imagine me pixeling sc2/4 gfx in Photoshop

Again I tell you that your app rocks and I'll use it. Just that I've been working with Photoshop since 8 years and I'm very confortable with its interface and tools.

And the export thing it's just about clicking the ASM button, or I must do something more?.

Thnx and keep on working

there are 3 ways of data export: asm (assembly source files), bas (MSX-BASIC compatible files, pattern and color table are saved 3 times within the file) and raw (headerless files with just 1 time pattern or color table).

The other buttons are to do the actual exporting (palette, patterns, colors). The binary headers for the MSX-BASIC type are set to the default locations of the tables for SCREEN 2 and SCREEN 4. Two simple BLOAD,S structures are enough to put them in the right place.

we'll see what we can do ..

but again: when loading bmp's etc., do you asume that those bmp's are sc2/4-ready? So, only 2 colors per line of 8 pixels?

yep, I assume the 2 colors per byte thing so no conversion needed. Except palette adaptation, I guess...

For a while I've thinking on ideas for Polka II .. the 'II' indicates major new stuff, not just an update of the current Polka, it would also mean a rewrite of certain parts. By itself that's not strange, since the original Polka was made within a week orso, after seeing there were ppl desperately messing around with all kinda converters, just to try/use VScreen. So it was all done a bit in a hurry ^_^.

Current news is that I made a refined button-object, a major new texture-generator (to be used for buttons/icons etc.), and a help-manager! So yes, buttons in any new app from me finally have button-help. This is in the form of a remote statusbar. (think of the statusbar in Photoshop, but then a small stylish remote-window that can be tucked away in some corner)

I won't start on Polka II today .. need to do some other things as well (RoA editor-features, other game-related stuff etc.) but when I start I'd like a list of doable suggestions from ppl ^_^. (so, not only from beardo_archivero )

Things I've planned myself for Polka II are:
- bigger application window (byebye to the cute 640x480 one)
- support for 32x24 characters, rather than only 32x8, hence the bigger window
- various image importers, including sc2, sc5, ge5, bmp (these last 3 might go through a converter if you didn't stick to the 'rules' )
- MSX1-mode and MSX2-mode (in MSX1-mode: true MSX1 colors, rather than the 'MSX2' colors)
- high-level colorsystem (also for MSX1-mode), to be used to re-index colors to new locations. This is handy for lighting effects and global color changes.
- high-level character manager
- functional map-editor .. not sure about this one, but a simple map-editor should be possible I guess. I aim for 2 modes: normal maps and macro maps. The normal maps are typical maps, a macro map is a list with macros, each macro has a width/height/xpos/ypos/colorscheme/../.., This means that for a platformgame for example, you could create a map with platforms that -except a single platform macro definition- only takes a few bytes to store. The use of this will be clear when you realise that The Goonies has 100 screens and the rest of the music/code/gfx all in a 32k ROM.


add yours
(either here in this topic, or #msxdev @ irc.rizon.org)