Bazix breaks relationship with MSX Association

by wolf_ on 26-06-2008, 02:45
Topic: MSX Revival
Languages:

You may have noticed that various things are going on in the MSX Revival lately, such as the recent transfer of the MSX trademarks from MSX Association to the MSX Licensing Corporation and the fact that there still isn't a Western edition of the 1chipMSX yet. Little over an hour ago, Bazix has announced on their website that Bazix has decided to stop being the European representative of MSX Association. A summary of the full message:

  • Bazix has not been able to bring the commercial MSX Revival beyond the Japanese borders
  • Bazix is no longer a representative of MSX Association
  • Bazix will not be able to deliver us the announced Western 1chipMSX
  • Woomb.net will be taken down until further notice. Current Woomb customers will be able to download and play their purchases though.
  • Bazix announces to cooperate with D4 Enterprise and the newly formed MSX Licensing Corporation in one or more retro gaming projects. More info will be expected during autumn 2008.

The full text can be read on the Bazix website. It's clear that Bazix has no intentions to stop their activities, but the transfer of the MSX trademark has put MSX Association into a different position. This, combined with the fact that the Western edition of the 1chipMSX hasn't worked out so far, made Bazix decide to break up with MSX Association and continue their activities with D4 Enterprise/MSX Licensing Corporation. As for the three announced prizes for the MEGA challenge, these have been secured. They will be 1chipMSX'es, but obviously not the intended Western ones.

To end with a bit more optimistic tone: There's still the Project MSX site from D4E. Who knows, the 'one or more retro gaming projects' may just be related to that. We'll keep you informed of further developments!

Relevant link: Bazix

Comments (53)

By Arjan

Paladin (694)

Arjan's picture

26-06-2008, 09:16

What is Nishi's role in all of this? I read Nishi's working for ITNY (owner of MSX Licensing Corporation), but is Nishi still involved with the MSX Association? Or did he just move to another company and took the trademarks with him?

By Huey

Prophet (2479)

Huey's picture

26-06-2008, 09:44

oO

By viejo_archivero

Paragon (1370)

viejo_archivero's picture

26-06-2008, 10:18

What about a graphic diagram of the actual scenario, or am I the only one who's pretty lost?

By pitpan

Prophet (2773)

pitpan's picture

26-06-2008, 10:46

Something like that: Wink

Users >- huge distance -< Companies

Now we only need another diagram for the companies' disputes. LOL!

Question #1: May I as independent freeware coder continue including the MSX logo/name in my productions?

Question #2: Is this breackage related to the fact that Nintendo is comercialising MSX games for the Wii virtual console? I mean, is it due to the "big profit outlook"? Sad

By dhau

Paragon (1499)

dhau's picture

26-06-2008, 11:20

I know what Nishi thinks:

1) Steal all underwear
2) ???
3) Profit!

By konamiman

Paladin (817)

konamiman's picture

26-06-2008, 12:04

Question #1: May I as independent freeware coder continue including the MSX logo/name in my productions?

I will do (well, I would do if needed). This people can call police whenever they want, well, if they aren't too busy killing themselves, of course.

Sorry but all this political stuff pisses me off a little already. I'm in the MSX world just for fun. Hannibal

By wolf_

Ambassador_ (9470)

wolf_'s picture

26-06-2008, 12:10

I wouldn't worry about using MSX logos as long as you don't mess-up the logo and as long as you aren't a commercial company.

By PAC

Guardian (2599)

PAC's picture

26-06-2008, 12:21

This situation is really strange. The most important now , who are good and who are bad? MSX Association, D4E? Who is preserving the MSX itself? QuestionSadQuestionSad

By pitpan

Prophet (2773)

pitpan's picture

26-06-2008, 12:40

The users. STOP. As in the last 15 years. FULL STOP.

By wolf_

Ambassador_ (9470)

wolf_'s picture

26-06-2008, 12:55

..and internet .. face it Tongue

By Maggoo

Paragon (1093)

Maggoo's picture

26-06-2008, 15:09

The most important now , who are good and who are bad? MSX Association, D4E? Who is preserving the MSX itself?

Why would there be anyone bad ?
Everyone is doing MSX stuffs as a hobby ony these days, who cares who "owns" the trademark. Will that change the way people play or develop MSX stuffs ? I dont think so

By dvik

Prophet (2176)

dvik's picture

26-06-2008, 18:04

I hope that the new organization will more friendly to emulators (MSX-A wasn't bad but not great either). I hope that system roms can be used freely and that the MSX logo can be used in emulators.

By SLotman

Paragon (1132)

SLotman's picture

26-06-2008, 21:48

So now we have two "MSX factions"?

MSX A. / MSX A. Europe / TNI

and

D4E / MSX LC / Bazix

Which "group" now holds the MSX rights? Which one is connected to the OCM? Which one is connected to Wii releases?

Are we now back to the time when MSX A. was created and wondering if they will or not "go after" all MSX sites?

Or does it mean now we can make some site like worldofspectrum.org for MSX with no fear of evil corporations taking it all down?

QuestionQuestionQuestionQuestionQuestion

By PAC

Guardian (2599)

PAC's picture

26-06-2008, 23:18


The most important now , who are good and who are bad? MSX Association, D4E? Who is preserving the MSX itself?

Why would there be anyone bad ?
Everyone is doing MSX stuffs as a hobby ony these days, who cares who "owns" the trademark. Will that change the way people play or develop MSX stuffs ? I dont think so

Is clear something happens, surely $$$$ problems or similar. Obviously these companies are in the MSX for money but I only would like to know what company is nearest to the MSX itself.

By dvik

Prophet (2176)

dvik's picture

26-06-2008, 23:34

Just because money may be involved doesn't mean that its a bad thing. If the new organizations does some thinking I'm sure they realize that their success can be boosted by an active community.

So basically. $$$ companies supports non profit organizations and enthusiasts which means more $$$'s to the companies and better for the enthusiasts.

Otoh, its unfortunately not uncommon that $$$ companies believes that the non profits is a threat but I hope that these new structures are smart enough to see to everyones best interest, including their own.

By karloch

Paragon (1807)

karloch's picture

27-06-2008, 00:34

It's sad to see things turned this way. Bazix's people worked so hard to bring MSX revival to Europe; even if they haven't managed to fully accomplish it at the end, I have to say a big thanks for trying so hard. Also, I agree with pitpan that MSX soul is the users: as long as we are arround, there will be MSX for many years Smile

By dvik

Prophet (2176)

dvik's picture

27-06-2008, 00:41

Yep, I agree. Keep up the good work.

By Randam

Champion (497)

Randam's picture

28-06-2008, 14:38

Sad to hear this has happened with Bazix. A real pity for their initiative and hard work. Also sad to see there's not gonna be a western OCM. Hopefully they intend to continue with their translations in one form or another.

By Samor

Paragon (1607)

Samor's picture

01-07-2008, 22:14

I have a woomb account but I don't have the launcher anymore.
Could someone provide me with the launcher app, so I can redownload the games?

By wolf_

Ambassador_ (9470)

wolf_'s picture

02-07-2008, 00:15

email bazix?

By Samor

Paragon (1607)

Samor's picture

02-07-2008, 01:51

that's what I did before... well, a woomb account, specifically.
I'll try a bazix one.

By Grauw

Prophet (2939)

Grauw's picture

04-07-2008, 20:22

So as far as I know MSX Association still claims to have the rights for the MSX brand? At the Den Dolder event, MSX Association mentioned royalties for commercial use of the MSX brand. The source linked to in the June 7 post is from a Benelux registry. What rights has ‘MSX Corporation’ acquired exactly? Just the Benelux rights, or worldwide? Is this disputed by the MSX Association?

By the way, isn’t it D4E that produced/distributed the 1chip MSX? I wonder why Bazix is blaming MSX Association for that now.

Either way, this is all very confusing, and it is probably understandable that I don’t really trust the MRC/Bazix reports Smile. It seems like more clarity can be given, but isn’t right now.

By Manuel

Ascended (9900)

Manuel's picture

04-07-2008, 23:42

No, the royalties would have to be paid to MSX Licensing Corporation. It's the same old rights MSXA had, but now in a specialized company.

D4E at least sells the ESE System 3 under the name "1chipMSX".

I don't understand your blaming remark...

By Manuel

Ascended (9900)

Manuel's picture

05-07-2008, 12:34

Note that on http://eur.msxa.org/ you can find more info and ask these questions directly to MSXA.

By Arjan

Paladin (694)

Arjan's picture

05-07-2008, 17:02

MSX Licensing corporation has the trademark on MSX in at least the Benelux (Belgium, Netherlands, Luxembourg) and in the US. Unfortunately it isn't possible to search in the Japanese trademark database due to maintenance.

Quoting from http://eur.msxa.org/
"MSX trademark and copyright has been under the MSX Licensing Corporation holding, chaired by Dr. Nishi, ever since 1983. MSX Association, chaired by Dr. Nishi, is the operational division of MSX Licensing Corporation and manages the MSX logo, trademarks and copyrights. Groups and organizations wishing to use the MSX logo should continue to apply for a (free) license at MSX Association."

By Buhi

Rookie (20)

Buhi's picture

05-07-2008, 22:42

It seems MSX Association made a specific report about this issue. http://eur.msxa.org/en/node/6

By Arjan

Paladin (694)

Arjan's picture

05-07-2008, 23:04

Strange reports, I don't know what to believe of all of it. When I read it, I really got a feeling Patriek would be the one behind the European website of MSXA.

Just did a tracert to the IP address of the server where eur.msxa.org is hosted, it actually goes to www.tni.nl! Something's fishy...

By wolf_

Ambassador_ (9470)

wolf_'s picture

05-07-2008, 23:09

you can paint a pear black, but you can't hide the fact it's still a pear.. Hannibal

By Buhi

Rookie (20)

Buhi's picture

05-07-2008, 23:18

Who is behind Bazix?
who is behind MRC?

Can you tell who is behind you?
| can tell you Mr. West is behind me.

By Huey

Prophet (2479)

Huey's picture

06-07-2008, 00:04

The report indeed shows some lack of professionalism. But I could be wrong as the language barrier could play parts.

As an association it's very unlikely that they would express such accusations in public. So I do have doubts...

By Sama

Ambassador (2048)

Sama's picture

06-07-2008, 15:31

The 'report' that's published at the European MSX Association website, is probably for most of you the first thing to see that the relationship between MSX Association and Bazix could not be carried any further. For us (Bazix), it's unfortunately not the first thing in this category to see. Of course, our version of this story is totally different. As Arjan already noticed, there's a link between the European MSXA and TNI. The person who has done his best to obstruct anything Bazix has tried to accomplish so far, is now closely involved in the European MSX Association and strikingly enough, unargumented accusations are thrown at Bazix once again - now from MSX Association's side. Even if there was any truth in MSX Association's story, wouldn't it be much more logical to solve this internally instead of posting some unconstructive post on a newly erected website?

For those who hadn't noticed yet: all recent news around MSX Association takes place in Europe, not in Japan anymore. Buhi is wondering who is behind MRC and who is behind Bazix, a matter that is of no importance here at all, but it reminds me of somebody who thought this to be a heated issue as well.

Anyway, we trust that things will be sorted out in the near future. Any official statements will be published at the Bazix website.

By Buhi

Rookie (20)

Buhi's picture

06-07-2008, 16:15

By Sama

Ambassador (2048)

Sama's picture

06-07-2008, 16:19

Hi Buhi, why ask such questions on a public forum?

By wolf_

Ambassador_ (9470)

wolf_'s picture

06-07-2008, 16:23

As for a who is behind who, I find it fascinating to see that "the only official contact place for MSX Association in Europe" has no information about what it is, who is behind it, who 'Admin' is, what they do, there's not even a link to the main domain (msxa) they're representing! Even the contact method shows no email address, only a form to fill in.

The only thing I recognize is the style of the language.. :P

By Buhi

Rookie (20)

Buhi's picture

06-07-2008, 16:26

sorry about I ask to you such a personal question on such a well-respected public forum as this.
I want to apologize to you in person, can I come to your house?

By Sama

Ambassador (2048)

Sama's picture

06-07-2008, 16:35

As you know my e-mail address, you're welcome to contact me by e-mail. I see no point in continuing this discussion over here.

By Buhi

Rookie (20)

Buhi's picture

06-07-2008, 16:48

Do you have time? I think you are busy person. If you have time let go out for drinks.
I give you a Heineken from my private money. If You like to drink more, you can give me a Carlsberg from somebody's money.

This is just hobby site right? I feel more open conversation is possible.

I am not interest for ask directly to you about your personal problem. I won't speak about your court problem in TOKYO.

By Huey

Prophet (2479)

Huey's picture

06-07-2008, 17:07

Bleh oO.... I'm leaving this thread. I'm allergic to mud throwing.........

By wolf_

Ambassador_ (9470)

wolf_'s picture

06-07-2008, 17:27

I see the "European" msxa site was updated with the name of the operator .. in Japanese .. Tongue

Now there's finally information! According to babelfish, the operator is called: Thorn use Kawahara. I'll use TUK from here.. so is this TUK guy also the Admin?

By Buhi

Rookie (20)

Buhi's picture

06-07-2008, 17:41

You look so happy.
TongueTongueTongueTongueTongueTongueTongueTongueTongue

By Manuel

Ascended (9900)

Manuel's picture

06-07-2008, 23:39

My advice: just have a real life talk. Much better than e-mail, always clears things up... and it can't hurt anyone.

By Samor

Paragon (1607)

Samor's picture

07-07-2008, 21:07

tracert also clears up a lot

tracert to msxa.org ends up at something wich looks asian

tracert to eur.msxa.org ends up at TNI.NL

tracert's do not lie...
Arjan already mentioned this, so I'm not gonna take credit... but in case I sound like a liar... surely your pc's command prompt doesn't lie.

By Grauw

Prophet (2939)

Grauw's picture

07-07-2008, 21:40

Yes, MSX Association has contacted TNI (amongst several other parties), and like TNI has organised the MSX 25th anniversary event, TNI is also hosting the European website. So?

By Samor

Paragon (1607)

Samor's picture

07-07-2008, 22:21

so? you tell me.
It's curious, to say the least.

By viejo_archivero

Paragon (1370)

viejo_archivero's picture

09-07-2008, 14:17

"In the past 3 years, MSX Association has not received any report (neither business nor financial reports) from Bazix about their operations as our 'representatives'. Furthermore, MSX Association never received any money from Bazix, neither did Bazix settle with us after they cut our relationship."

/me curious on that. Bazix never reported anything neither gave a cent to MSXA?

By Samor

Paragon (1607)

Samor's picture

09-07-2008, 22:33

I'd like to know that too. Some other reports I read kind of claimed the opposite.

By snout

Ambassador (14856)

snout's picture

10-07-2008, 23:07

I don't know whether there's a point in discussing all this publicly (which is why I haven't joined the discussion until now), but I would just like to stress that Bazix has - of course - sent reports to MSX Association. I don't know why this, amongst other things, is stated on the European MSXA website (which currently appears to be down) as MSXA could've easily contacted us by e-mail or phone, should there be any unclarities.

By rolins

Champion (411)

rolins's picture

11-07-2008, 17:12

@Samor - I have a backup of the woomb launcher. I can send it by email if you still need it.

I hope Woomb comes back soon, I was really looking forward to more Microcabin and T&ESOFT.

By Samor

Paragon (1607)

Samor's picture

13-07-2008, 13:02

thanks rolins, but I already got it Smile

By rolins

Champion (411)

rolins's picture

16-07-2008, 06:50

I already bought alot of games from woomb and there's still a 2 more I'm interested in. Is it possible to still make a last minute request? How can I get in touch with people at woomb? Question

By hap

Paragon (1911)

hap's picture

12-07-2011, 19:23

errata:
Since people are still having strong opinions about this, as member of the MRC crew, I would like to correct that we wrongly informed you about "the newly formed MSX Licensing Corporation" and "the recent transfer of the MSX trademarks from MSX Association to the MSX Licensing Corporation", which was either a misunderstanding or false propaganda from D4E for commercial reasons, copy/pasted from the former company Bazix without having done our own research. On behalf of the MRC crew, I apologize if this newspost caused an influx of bad reputation to MSX Association Japan in 2008.

The simple truth is written as above in one of the comments: "MSX trademark and copyright has been under the MSX Licensing Corporation holding, chaired by Dr. Nishi, ever since 1983. MSX Association, chaired by Dr. Nishi, is the operational division of MSX Licensing Corporation and manages the MSX logo, trademarks and copyrights."

By JohnHassink

Ambassador (4152)

JohnHassink's picture

12-07-2011, 19:57

I give you a Heineken from my private money.
Can I get a Grolsch then?

My MSX profile