Armchair coding Stunt Car Racer

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By hit9918

Prophet (2751)

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13-12-2017, 21:13

I want it nicer than the ZX image

on the MSX the black lines in the sky got to go, but in the ground zone they can keep
voila 3 color hires

By TomH

Master (200)

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13-12-2017, 22:50

I guess that'd be a vote in favour of the MSX 2 then?

One further thought: if adding the opponent turns out significantly to trouble the general drawing algorithm, it could always be moved onto the sprite layer. Rendered afresh each frame, but left to the VDP to composite. Obviously with normal-sized sprites and no flicker you're limited to an overlay image of 64x128, but if you double-size them then perhaps the flicker you'd sometimes need to cover the entire opponent would be worth it for the simplified track rendering? Probably not, but worth considering as a potential MSX architectural advantage.

By santiontanon

Hero (584)

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13-12-2017, 23:18

About the only drawing "what is different from the previous frame", I think there was another thread where Grauw was discussing this idea on his own 3d polygon renderer if I don't recall incorrectly. Can't remember the results though!

About the opponent, I was also thinking that a sprite might be the way to go. After having played a couple of games of Stunt-Car Racer yesterday, the opponent was never rendered too big as for not being drawable with 4 sprites side-by-side. So, even an MSX1 should be able to do that (but with a monochrome opponent). So, that might be the way to go!

By hit9918

Prophet (2751)

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13-12-2017, 23:34

no I meant MSX1!
the 3 colors hires was a description for MSX1
to have colors like C64 game, not like ZX game

By Grauw

Enlighted (7248)

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14-12-2017, 01:51

@santiontanon Iirc where the experiment left off was that drawing deltas still has potential, on R800 especially, but I wanted to change the algorithm from scanline rendering into a span-buffer with z-culling to per-polygon rendering with painter’s algorithm and a simplified span-buffer. It would be a lot faster because I could keep state in local registers and remove a lot of memory access, since I only need to consider one triangle (two edges) at a time.

Also there are are literally a ton of other optimisations that can be done for 3D rendering, many to do with precalculating, culling everything that can possibly be culled, doing certain calculations in world or view space rather than after projection, and optimising the matrix math. There’s a lot to be gained, but it’s also a lot of work.

Didn’t work on it lately though, maybe I’ll pick it up again sometime in the future. By the way, I started that experiment because Overflow remarked something like “stop yappin and start coding” Wink. I like yapping though, mind, so I wouldn’t want to express the same sentiment, but I still think it’s funny Smile.

By PingPong

Prophet (3097)

PingPong's picture

14-12-2017, 21:50

hit9918 wrote:

no I meant MSX1!
the 3 colors hires was a description for MSX1
to have colors like C64 game, not like ZX game

and the colour clash ?

By hit9918

Prophet (2751)

hit9918's picture

14-12-2017, 23:14

I described it, no black lines in the sky

anyways screen 2 can look a lot like the amiga version

for example where the street turns left in the distance, there the 8x1 mode does much better than 8x8 modi

By PingPong

Prophet (3097)

PingPong's picture

17-12-2017, 12:16

hit9918 wrote:

I described it, no black lines in the sky

anyways screen 2 can look a lot like the amiga version

for example where the street turns left in the distance, there the 8x1 mode does much better than 8x8 modi

the screenshot is from amiga.
on screen 2 it will look different. for example the road cannot have borders (or at least need thick borders)

By Lord_Zett

Paladin (807)

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17-12-2017, 13:13

look ad this.
screen 2
https://youtu.be/-yNNS69r_8E

By TomH

Master (200)

TomH's picture

18-12-2017, 15:47

A voxel engine at that sort of precision prevents angled tracks, and makes pitch a problem in addition to roll. That's presumably why in the demo shown the example tracks are all individual level segments (no convincing way to draw an angled track, no convincing way to rotate the camera onto an angled track), the player never looks uphill or downhill and never leaves the ground (as pitching wouldn't render correctly), and as a net result the player has to keep nearly stopping at every corner, rotating the car to the new direction of travel and then accelerating again.

I'm sure there are others, but the main successful implementation of a voxel engine in the 8-bit world that I'm aware of was probably for Rescue on Fractalus (making a guess based on the output alone), which also uses a limited number of colours to hide deficiencies and involves helicopter-esque motion to avoid pitch and roll. Then, of course, the big hitter a couple of generations later was Commanche, which is actually set in a helicopter.

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