poll:outrun for msx2

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By wolf_

Ambassador_ (9765)

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02-06-2019, 10:48

It's always easier to make a new game that sits right within the boundaries of the system, rather than adapting a game from a much larger system. Hyper Rally doesn't have hills and it doesn't have more than two lanes, nor does it have significantly large objects aside and above the road that move along.

By Ivan

Ascended (9092)

Ivan's picture

02-06-2019, 11:42

Quote:

Chase HQ is horrible on all 8 bit platforms.

I'm sorry but I disagree with you, it is considered one of the best games ever made for ZX Spectrum and fortunately the MSX version played on Panasonic MSX2+ computers (Z80B CPU) is almost identical to its Speccy counterpart.

Forks in the road, kerbs, broken line marking between lanes, changes of slope, lane merging, car jumps, big objects next to the road (trees, buildings, rocks, etc.), helicopter like in the original arcade, tunnels,... It is pretty good in my humble opinion.

I think the game needs some patching to speed it up a little bit -specially at forks in the road and when there is a lot of action on the screen- (this also happens in the ZX Spectrum version) and to sort out that blinking line on the horizon in stages 2 and 4 (seems to be a bug exclusively of the MSX port).

By NYYRIKKI

Enlighted (5320)

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02-06-2019, 11:37

On pseudo 3D games there are more to compare than just Hyper Rally or direct ZX-ports.. ie:
This one is with hills... even loops, but no "real" side objects.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3bg8tAZCicE
Smooth animation, but weird roadside distance and only small side objects.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K7POrYtDGBI
Really cool road routine, side objects done with 1-color sprites.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wVdbP_yvnsc
SpeedKing deserves special mention, because it is only of these games that I've really played a lot.. No side objects
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zFYE8sC5_nw

By journey

Champion (357)

journey's picture

02-06-2019, 11:56

I have a dream:

OUTRUN for V9990 + OPL4 Smile

By Ivan

Ascended (9092)

Ivan's picture

02-06-2019, 12:24

NYYRIKKI, indeed, there are more racing games with that pseudo 3D scrolling, I also played a lot Coaster Race because I had (and still have) the original cartridge. But Chase H.Q. imho has way more advanced effects combined that all the games that you have mentioned. I think that it implements pretty well the so-called (by that time) bilinear parallax scrolling to resize sprites which was first used by Sega (Hang-On, Out Run, Space Harrier,..).

I do also like a lot the effect where the landscape has different line sizes (I don't know how to call it) to enhance the 3D perspective (and sense of speed) which is also present in Chase H.Q. and very well done in games like Buck Rogers and Vaxol:

Buck Rogers
Vaxol

By wimpie3

Master (252)

wimpie3's picture

02-06-2019, 13:30

Not for the MSX but very interesting for those interested in how to draw roads:
https://codeincomplete.com/posts/javascript-racer-v1-straight/

By Grauw

Ascended (8307)

Grauw's picture

02-06-2019, 14:08

Penguin Adventure? Smile

By theNestruo

Expert (106)

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02-06-2019, 14:34

wimpie3 wrote:

Not for the MSX but very interesting for those interested in how to draw roads:
https://codeincomplete.com/posts/javascript-racer-v1-straight/

Unfortunately, it seems to be no articles explaining how roads were drawn in 8-bit machines without special hardware. Despite these articles being matematically accurate (and a quite interesting read indeed), translating floating point formulas to Z80 would be, in my opinion, innefficient.

I've thought about this matter often, looking for a theoretical approach on how to determine the side lines of the road, allowing turns and hills. What I would do is:

  • Start at (x,y)=(0, 191) for the sake of simplicity; horizontal displacement would vary the initial X position
  • Target at (tx,ty)=(128-16, 128), that would be the vanishing point of the left side of the road (with (128+16, 128) for the right side of the road; the delta of 16px should be adjusted to the best looking option)
  • Draw a segment of 1/8 from (x,y) to (tx,ty) and update (x,y) to the end of this segment
  • Displace the target point according to the road: if the next segment turns right, move tx to the right (10px, for example); if the next segment is downhill, move ty down (5px, for example)
  • Draw a segment of 1/7 from (x,y) to (tx,ty), displace again, segment again, until x,y reaches tx,ty
  • Do the same thing for the right border

When moving forward, the first segment should be proportional to the remaining part of the current section of the road. For the sake of simplicity, consider a section with length of 8 "units". If the car has moved 3 "units", the first segment should be (8-3)/8 of the full lenght of the segment (that was 1/8): that is 5 / 64.
The segments aren't actually drawn, but used to compute the x-left and the x-right for each y, and which section of the road is at an specific y position. This segments would be travelled using either Bresenham or EFLA algorhitms, and probably both sides at the same time to save time (every target would be have exactly the same Y values either side).
Then the drawing part would use these two tables (section at y, xleft-xright at y) to draw the horizontal line in the CHRTBL and put the proper colors in the CLRTBL (each section of the road having different green on the sides, etc.)
And, as stated in a previous post I would use NAMTBL patches to draw side elements.

But again, these are my thoughs; there is no real code, and I don't know if the result would be good-looking enough, efficient enough, or just pure garbage.
Maybe a BASIC/TurboBASIC prototype could be coded, and played at 2x or 3x speed in an emulator to check if this approach is actually feasible...

By theNestruo

Expert (106)

theNestruo's picture

02-06-2019, 14:33

Grauw wrote:

Penguin Adventure? Smile

Penguin Adventure and Anctarctic Adventure are very similar to Hyper Rally... and even had cooler details: the clouds, the scenery changes mid-stage...

By Grauw

Ascended (8307)

Grauw's picture

02-06-2019, 17:19

F1 Spirit 3D Special?

https://youtu.be/SE-SHwV5v2M

Uses splits and horizontal scrolling… Would be nice if someone could fill in more details, e.g. for the hills do they use vertical scrolling (doesn’t that give sprite issues), or is the middle part in screen 4?

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