Testing sound of different MSX sound chips and their FPGA implementations

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By Parn

Champion (326)

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08-05-2018, 16:45

@Eugeny_Brychkov: That's very interesting to know. I was wondering whether the difference in the harpsichord instrument was due to the instrument settings or the emulation accuracy, but I really liked the sound of it, very pleasant. Would rate it even higher if I didn't like the Sanyo sound so much. I'm aware the Sanyo has some problems with balance between the various sound sources, though.

@syn: I was surprised by it as well. I thought the Panasonic MSX2+ models were regarded as having great sound. It reminded me of the turboR.

@Pencioner: Sounds like too much filtering to me, but I don't really know whether the filter capacitors can gain capacitance as they get old, since they're not electrolytic, AFAIK.

@Guillian: Looking forward to watching the video! Now I regret having used the "hate" word, it's really too strong. I just think the filtering may be too strong and I don't really enjoy what it does to the character of the sound, but on the other side it may be closer to the turboR sound, and I'm aware many people prefer it because they grew accustomed to it. It's not really a matter of what is better, but what you prefer. I acknowledge my bias, since I used to use an external FM cartridge with really bad filtering (it was noisy and squeaky and I liked it just as well).

@gdx: I think it is well known that we subjectively tend to rate louder music as "better". A fairer comparison would be to try to amplify both recordings to similar levels.

By Meits

Scribe (5237)

Meits's picture

08-05-2018, 16:45

There's quite some difference between Carnivore 2 and MFR in the advantage of the latter. I miss a lot of high tone. On the other hand I think I wouldn't mind using the MSX-Music of the Carnivore 2.

By syn

Paragon (1891)

syn's picture

08-05-2018, 17:45

Parn wrote:

@gdx: I think it is well known that we subjectively tend to rate louder music as "better". A fairer comparison would be to try to amplify both recordings to similar levels.

indeed, louder is not better.

i did a quick compare (ony 10 minutes)

Seems the panasonic has some stronger high pass filtering than the sanyo or just stronger mids and (higher) lows.

By Pencioner

Paladin (799)

Pencioner's picture

08-05-2018, 18:25

Parn wrote:

@gdx: I think it is well known that we subjectively tend to rate louder music as "better". A fairer comparison would be to try to amplify both recordings to similar levels.

I has been doing at least 2-3 test passes, correcting volume level by the way, before i start actual recording, to keep the peak level around -6..-5 db for all sound sources. I understand that because of different frequency response the equality of peak level doesn't make the equality of actual sound volume, though

By Parn

Champion (326)

Parn's picture

08-05-2018, 18:31

@syn: I'm under the impression that there is both. It's not bad that the Panasonic has stronger bass, but it may be overwhelming in better speakers or headphones. This is all, of course, very subjective and it also depends on the listening gear. I'm listening to it in my notebook with Apple phone buds (not the most recent ones). I'll try making another comparison at home with my Porta Pro headphones and my Creative Labs 2.1 speakers.

By syn

Paragon (1891)

syn's picture

08-05-2018, 18:38

Parn wrote:

This is all, of course, very subjective and it also depends on the listening gear.

I have a pair of (low-end ) monitor speakers which should have relatively flat frequency response.

Anything else like apple earbuds and creative speakers should have (like any consumer electronics) a "smiley" curve (boosted low and high ends), which might be "overwhelming" as you say, on these kinda devices.

By Pablibiris

Paragon (1714)

Pablibiris's picture

08-05-2018, 21:51

Guillian wrote:
Parn wrote:

I like the MFR sound better than the WX one, but I was surprised at how bad the Carnivore sounds. Rounded waveforms, muffled frequencies, really bad. I would like to see more varied samples, especially with more volume variation and some noise as well.

I made a video comparing a real SCC, MFR SD and Carnivore 2. Also a real FM and Carnivore 2.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9ZXvKYnl2Ww

Great difference of both sounds :O

I always said it ... the sound of the Carnivore is VERY improvable :(

By Parn

Champion (326)

Parn's picture

08-05-2018, 21:09

@syn: According to this analysis Apple earbuds actually are weaker in the low end, although the high end is clearly boosted, unlike the Beats which boost both ends considerably. The Porta Pro has a flatter frequency response curve and should be better for this kind of evaluation.

@Guillian: The Carnivore 2 really doesn't fare too well against the FM-PAC. :/

By Guillian

Prophet (3189)

Guillian's picture

08-05-2018, 21:20

Parn wrote:

@Guillian: The Carnivore 2 really doesn't fare too well against the FM-PAC. :/

I agree. Also its SCC sounds "different" compared to the real one, or MFR SD.

By Pentarou

Master (151)

Pentarou's picture

08-05-2018, 23:34

Were the Carnivore2 tests done on just one computer or on multiple machines?
AFAIK C2 uses 12v to power the internal amp (SCC and MFR don't), so results could change depending on quality of the PSU.

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