MSX SP 2022 - Live with Kazuhiko Nishi

MSX SP 2022 - Live with Kazuhiko Nishi

by ro on 31-12-2022, 16:31
Topic: Events
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Brazil, December the 10th - the MSX users meeting at São Paulo city happened. One of the main events there was the live connection and interview with Kazuhiko Nishi about future MSX plans. The recorded conversation can be viewed on YouTube.

After three years of absence -for well known reasons-, the MSX SP meeting finally opened doors. This gathering of 8-bit enthusiastic took place in São Paulo city, Brazil. The fair with tables of wonderful MSX related goods like an exhibition of MSX items, new software and demonstrations, opened doors at 10:00. About 90 visitors were present.

The main event was the live conversations with Kazuhiko Nishi, with real-live translation JP-PT(BR). The recorded version has been dubbed with English subtitles too. The father of MSX talked about new projects, like the MSX0, MSX3, MSX Turbo and more!

The get-together ended with a presentation of the "Loading... our first computer" games documentary with presence of the directors Carlos Bighetti and Marcus Garrett. The documentary portrays the beginning of the development of computer games in Brazilian scene.

relevant link: MSX SP event
relevant link: Interview with Kazuhiko Nishi

Comments (28)

By Latok

msx guru (3908)

Latok's picture

01-01-2023, 12:56

So the MSX0 is a matchbox sized rasberry pi-like device with a sensor connected, MSX Turbo is a multi cpu device for educating purposes... And because Nishi thinks that modern tv's need a mediabox connected to make them show Netflix or Youtube, he wants to make an easy to use computer which you can connect to a big TV so you can stream Netflix and YouTube on it... This is the MSX3. Which will be powered by the '9998 video'...

And everyone in the room is applauding...

By ro

Scribe (4860)

ro's picture

01-01-2023, 13:49

You know, I'm skeptical as well. The ideas of mr Nishi are so far of the MSX standard, I lost interest already. If I want to see some Netflix show, I'll just turn on the (smart) tv and go. And that's just an example of modern techno providing me with services. MSX has no place there, at all.

Having a stack of boards piled up to make one huge IOT something, something that doesn't even have the default MSX Basic/dos/whathave you.... I'm out. Nothing to do with MSX.

What I am super exited about, is the fact that sensei Nishi is having MSX in mind. And the fact that we have more and more connections with the land-of-the-rising-sun when it comes to MSX related matters. Not only mr Nishi, but also developers from back when, even from big companies.

So yeah, am I waiting for another MSX generation? Not really, or not at all. I'd rather have spare parts for my turbo R, to start with. If we're talking hardware, that is.

The Brazilian meeting is awesome, the people surrounding it are awesome, the whole show is awesome. Enough reasons to stay tuned to his old system for much longer.

By ducasp

Hero (661)

ducasp's picture

01-01-2023, 15:42

ro wrote:

You know, I'm skeptical as well. The ideas of mr Nishi are so far of the MSX standard, I lost interest already. If I want to see some Netflix show, I'll just turn on the (smart) tv and go. And that's just an example of modern techno providing me with services. MSX has no place there, at all.

Having a stack of boards piled up to make one huge IOT something, something that doesn't even have the default MSX Basic/dos/whathave you.... I'm out. Nothing to do with MSX.

What I am super exited about, is the fact that sensei Nishi is having MSX in mind. And the fact that we have more and more connections with the land-of-the-rising-sun when it comes to MSX related matters. Not only mr Nishi, but also developers from back when, even from big companies.

So yeah, am I waiting for another MSX generation? Not really, or not at all. I'd rather have spare parts for my turbo R, to start with. If we're talking hardware, that is.

The Brazilian meeting is awesome, the people surrounding it are awesome, the whole show is awesome. Enough reasons to stay tuned to his old system for much longer.

It is naive to think he is doing a commercial endeavor to appease a small retro community and perhaps sell 2, 3,5 thousand units at best...

This is something trying to reach a way broader audience and at the same time paying homage and respect as much as possible for the retro community and the origins of the brand... MSX3 seems like the best they can do to pay homage / respect to the scene, not bad at all, while everyone has their own wish list and will dislike a couple (or a dozen) things Tongue

Will this work? Who knows I think that's again, like Turbo-R, too little too late, but really whish Nishi and msx 0 / 3 / Turbo luck, if that was materialized three or four years ago it would have better chance in my point of view.

By Pac

Scribe (6895)

Pac's picture

02-01-2023, 09:24

Understandably Nishi, as a business man, has more plans for this new platform apart from trying to satisfy the current MSX scene. But with every passing day, everything is more confusing and the MSX essence is disappearing... What I'm wondering from the beginning is, will there finally be a version designed and focused on those users that just want to enjoy the MSX experience in a modern hardware? And in that case which one? Question

By wolf_

Ambassador_ (10076)

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01-01-2023, 21:38

The main problem is that back in the days there were multiple systems, all with their own internal software. Today there are still multiple systems, but they all run one of the few mainstream systems; e.g. portable versions of Windows, some Linux distro, Android, iOS etc. So, the small device to operate your tv already exists as soon as someone makes an app for one of the systems I just listed. CPU, memory, graphics and sound were critical factors in the 80's, not anymore so today.

Nishi wants of offer a solution to a problem that doesn't exist anymore.

By gdx

Enlighted (5984)

gdx's picture

02-01-2023, 17:17

ro wrote:

The ideas of mr Nishi are so far of the MSX standard, I lost interest already.

MSX standard is just:
1/ it can be used on a TV
2/ software can be used on MSX from other brands.

It is difficult to respect the second parameter. The first will be respected it seems to me.

By ray2day

Paladin (719)

ray2day's picture

02-01-2023, 23:04

I think MSXVR is even more MSX3

By ivke2006

Expert (88)

ivke2006's picture

03-01-2023, 11:58

There is a lot of negativism about the things Nishi is working on. But IMHO a lot of people of the MSX scene are still active due to nostalgic reasons. Nishi stated multiple times he doesn’t live in the past and want to make something for the future. So it’s not targeted towards the old MSX scene.
Furthermore, it’s due to translation and cultural differences, sometimes hard to understand what it exactly will be.
My understanding is that he wants the MSX3 to be the ultimate home computer. Multi media, game console, user friendly and easy to be creative or develop with. Not a setup box.
My first 2 MSX computers where also connected to the TV and not a monitor. Consoles are also mostly connected to the TV in the living room.

If and to what extent he will be successful..we will see

By ivke2006

Expert (88)

ivke2006's picture

03-01-2023, 14:41

No edit? Settopbox not setup box

By wolf_

Ambassador_ (10076)

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03-01-2023, 15:47

The window of editing is limited, after a while you can't edit anymore.

By Micha

Expert (83)

Micha's picture

03-01-2023, 17:24

I could see potential in an MSX0 device, if it is what I think/hope it is... If it is a small box to control IOT stuff and it is programmable with MSX basic, that would be pretty cool (if at the right price).

By ray2day

Paladin (719)

ray2day's picture

03-01-2023, 18:58

Quote:

IMHO a lot of people of the MSX scene are still active due to nostalgic reasons. Nishi stated multiple times he doesn’t live in the past and want to make something for the future. So it’s not targeted towards the old MSX scene.
Furthermore, it’s due to translation and cultural differences, sometimes hard to understand what it exactly will be.
My understanding is that he wants the MSX3 to be the ultimate home computer. Multi media, game console, user friendly

Exactly and to my honest opinion the nostalgia is the reason that kept the MSX scene alive in the first place. I have great respect to mr. Nishi and what he created in the past and what he tries to achief in the future. I did not meant to be negative, but I think you have to be realistic.

Quote:

If and to what extent he will be successful..we will see

...indeed. Like I always say: "Keep the scene alive! / Keep up the good work!"

By PingPong

Prophet (4086)

PingPong's picture

04-01-2023, 13:34

Latok wrote:

So the MSX0 is a matchbox sized rasberry pi-like device with a sensor connected, MSX Turbo is a multi cpu device for educating purposes... And because Nishi thinks that modern tv's need a mediabox connected to make them show Netflix or Youtube, he wants to make an easy to use computer which you can connect to a big TV so you can stream Netflix and YouTube on it... This is the MSX3. Which will be powered by the '9998 video'...

And everyone in the room is applauding...

I think all those WONDERFUL things have pratically nothing to do with MSX as a retro entusiast would expect.....
So i do not expect a big success......

By PingPong

Prophet (4086)

PingPong's picture

04-01-2023, 13:38

ro wrote:

You know, I'm skeptical as well. The ideas of mr Nishi are so far of the MSX standard, I lost interest already. If I want to see some Netflix show, I'll just turn on the (smart) tv and go. And that's just an example of modern techno providing me with services. MSX has no place there, at all.

Having a stack of boards piled up to make one huge IOT something, something that doesn't even have the default MSX Basic/dos/whathave you.... I'm out. Nothing to do with MSX.

those new MSXes are only a different thing with a (non well drawn) MSX label on top..

By PingPong

Prophet (4086)

PingPong's picture

04-01-2023, 13:41

ivke2006 wrote:

There is a lot of negativism about the things Nishi is working on. But IMHO a lot of people of the MSX scene are still active due to nostalgic reasons. Nishi stated multiple times he doesn’t live in the past and want to make something for the future. So it’s not targeted towards the old MSX scene.

That's ok, but then, do not call this thing MSX anymore. ;-)

By ivke2006

Expert (88)

ivke2006's picture

04-01-2023, 14:29

Why not? It’s (to certain extent) compatible with previous MSX generations, it’s developed by the founder of MSX, it’s continues the strong points(cheap, powerful, expandable, multimedia, creative) of MSX in the past..only modernised like IOT focus.
No offensive but It’s not up to the nostalgic MSX users to decide how the MSX future looks. Realistically, hardware architecture cannot remain legacy if new MSX computers should be developed. The same for OS.

By wolf_

Ambassador_ (10076)

wolf_'s picture

04-01-2023, 15:28

But then the question is whether a brand is allowed to spread its wings into territory it wasn't known for at the start. That's an interesting subject actually. The brand Pioneer is now famous for DJ-controllers, while before that it was just a brand of car radios. DJ's are happy, but I doubt any DJ thinks about car radios when they're using that gear.

On the other side:
What if the old Atari brand starts making gamer PC's (those standard and usually futuristic looking PC cases)? So, a regular gamer PC, with LED-lights everywhere and plexiglass exteriors, with the Atari logo on the case. Would that piss-off the old Atari scene? I think it would, because: why not use another name instead?

So, what Nishi does/wants, I think, is just make 'a product' (of which I doubt there's a viable market, but alas) and he calls it 'MSX'. And yeah, maybe it would be compatible in some way to the old MSX'es, but so is any PC running an emulator. So the real question is: why call it MSX, knowing it's a 40 year old retro brand that has nothing to do with his recent plans? Couldn't he come up with any other name?

By Latok

msx guru (3908)

Latok's picture

04-01-2023, 16:04

wolf_ wrote:

So the real question is: why call it MSX, knowing it's a 40 year old retro brand that has nothing to do with his recent plans? Couldn't he come up with any other name?

Because, for his 'plans', he needs trust. And the overseas MSX retro scene still has trust in Nishi. And therefore is most likely willing to pay his 'crowdfunding'.

By wolf_

Ambassador_ (10076)

wolf_'s picture

04-01-2023, 16:13

Some business plan then, where you rely on <5000 people who don't even like your product.

By Latok

msx guru (3908)

Latok's picture

04-01-2023, 16:29

wolf_ wrote:

Some business plan then, where you rely on <5000 people who don't even like your product.

If only 100 people transfer 1.000 euros, that's still a lot of ramen ^_^

By ducasp

Hero (661)

ducasp's picture

05-01-2023, 12:11

wolf_ wrote:

So the real question is: why call it MSX, knowing it's a 40 year old retro brand that has nothing to do with his recent plans? Couldn't he come up with any other name?

He owns the brand and if he wants to put it in a matchbox he can. Why? Question is why not? He is a business man and want to generate buzz to his newest products, do you know a better way than having it with a brand that is somewhat known around the world?

Most people still are thinking he is targeting retro community, while in fact msx3 is the closest thing to appeal to that community (and nevertheless the one less talked), msx 0 is his focus, even msx turbo did not get uch attention. His focus isn't retro community but IOT and newcomers to it, trying to offer a different and possibly easier way to enter this. That is the true, IF, and that is a huuuuge IF, IF MSX3 ever gets released and not only MSX0 and msx turbo, that is the product that tries to appease the retro community, and it is far from being the priority.

It is like complaining Volkswagen put a water cooled engine on the new beetle, full of electronics and no longer the simple engine even non mechanics could fix... Why they did that? It is unavoidable Tongue

By ivke2006

Expert (88)

ivke2006's picture

05-01-2023, 12:45

ducasp wrote:

It is like complaining Volkswagen put a water cooled engine on the new beetle, full of electronics and no longer the simple engine even non mechanics could fix... Why they did that? It is unavoidable Tongue

Exactly!

By wolf_

Ambassador_ (10076)

wolf_'s picture

05-01-2023, 15:04

Do note that I don't care a rat's ass about what Nishi's intentions are, nor am I complaining about anything. If ever he manages to bring something onto the market, I expect neither of us will be interested in it. I'm just expressing that it's weird that a new business relies on the name of a mainly 80's system that is currently upheld by <5000 persons worldwide. Whatever extra exposure there could be is probably based on modern-day Metal Gear fans playing the old MG in an emulator.

The Volkswagen-example doesn't work, because car development is a gradual process. So, gradually engines get better, cruise control is added, airco is added, electric windows etc. etc. MSX is not exactly gradual anno today. The last real MSX is about 30 years old, the 1chip is more like a generic fpga-system with cartridge slots. So, anyone born in this millennium... has little connection to the MSX legacy.

How about this one. Forget the Atari example I gave. Let's imagine that now Mattel makes this new gamer PC, with the name Intellivision and the same font. Even though Mattel owns the name and can do whatever with it, would it make actual sense to do so?

By ray2day

Paladin (719)

ray2day's picture

05-01-2023, 18:00

Quote:

It’s (to certain extent) compatible with previous MSX generations

Ever heard of OpenMSX?? It's quite 'compatible' as well... Wink

By ducasp

Hero (661)

ducasp's picture

05-01-2023, 21:54

wolf_ wrote:

Do note that I don't care a rat's ass about what Nishi's intentions are, nor am I complaining about anything. If ever he manages to bring something onto the market, I expect neither of us will be interested in it. I'm just expressing that it's weird that a new business relies on the name of a mainly 80's system that is currently upheld by <5000 persons worldwide. Whatever extra exposure there could be is probably based on modern-day Metal Gear fans playing the old MG in an emulator.

The Volkswagen-example doesn't work, because car development is a gradual process. So, gradually engines get better, cruise control is added, airco is added, electric windows etc. etc. MSX is not exactly gradual anno today. The last real MSX is about 30 years old, the 1chip is more like a generic fpga-system with cartridge slots. So, anyone born in this millennium... has little connection to the MSX legacy.

How about this one. Forget the Atari example I gave. Let's imagine that now Mattel makes this new gamer PC, with the name Intellivision and the same font. Even though Mattel owns the name and can do whatever with it, would it make actual sense to do so?

Yeah, I don't care about it either, but hey, here we are discussing it and generating buzz... There were quite a few sites talking about MSX having a new piece of hardware after such a long time... That's exactly why this is being called MSX0 and not NishIOT Wink

And the Beetle example is quite fine, between the last sold original beetle and the new beetle quite several years have elapsed, the only Beetle thing from the one produced in the 80s and 90s to the one produced recently is the name... Computer industry also is about gradual evolution, but if you stop following it, can't expect to have a simple iteration with a minor evolution over the last one, unless of course you are trying to appeal to a niche audience.

I couldn't care less about MSX0 and MSX TURBO, and just skeptical about MSX3, hoping for a nice surprise but not really expecting it... I just understand why Nishi is doing that, and probably this is a chance to be different than the rest of IOT stuff, generate buzz and try to sell it to a broader audience, let's see how it pans out idf it sees the light of the day Tongue

By ATroubleshooter

Expert (95)

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10-01-2023, 15:58

I just like it. Smile

By enribar

Paragon (1203)

enribar's picture

17-01-2023, 18:28

in the meantime, the crowdfunding is having great success!
It's a pity that its opened only for Japan audience (for now).
https://camp-fire.jp/projects/view/648742
I trust Nishi and MSX0!

By Accumulator

Expert (105)

Accumulator's picture

24-01-2023, 04:32

I really don't give a f!#k what kind of processor and cores it has. My wildest dream is Nishi-san is chosing a video processor of this era, and not one that is over 20 years old. Above all, providing information how to address this (custom) VDP (NVIDIA, which has the best GPU, no discussion possible, (and able to provide compatibly to Yamaha V9938/V9958, which is also a successor to Texas Instruments, so I dont give a f#!k, or emulating)
Everyone has to move on, but... addressing the VDP directly and instructing GPU without using drivers in order to create unimaginable and epic results is a must!
Assembly is assembly, if you got the vibe, you can code on anything! From a Nuclear reactor to your doorbell.