Go Penguin WIP platformer for MSX 1

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Van gdx

Enlighted (4813)

afbeelding van gdx

04-05-2021, 10:35

"1001 Spikes" has acceleration, progressive speed/camera movement, variable height jumps, etc.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lOHyKPmYcF0

It's important for some actions. It depends on what we want to do as action.

Van Daemos

Paragon (1954)

afbeelding van Daemos

04-05-2021, 11:12

Its not about making the controls like games we always like to talk about. Its about making the controls in a way that it feels great. If controls feel stiff the game feels stiff. Falling with 16 px per second directly after stepping of a platform feels nowhere like fun. It should feel natural and controllable. Good player physics are a horror to code and usually avoided. However very good player physics make the game feel great. But most important is that the player physics match the game. Do not copy them from another game otherwise you end up with a clone of that game. Just add the things you like and code the rules along the way. Eventually it will feel smooth.

Also keep in mind that complex physics take cpu cycles. Sometime many of them so its always a compromise.

Van santiontanon

Paragon (1524)

afbeelding van santiontanon

04-05-2021, 15:56

@gdx: 1001 spikes has 0 horizontal inertia! you can turn from moving right to left full speed in 1 game frame (I've played infinite hour of it hahaha), as for the variable height jumps: jumps have fixed height, there's just two buttons: short jump and high jump. This helps in precision with jumping (exactly 1 tile high, or exactly 2 tiles high), which is necessary given the extreme situations this game puts you through Smile

@daemos: sure, it is common to have vertical inertia for jumping, that feels natural and should be implemented to avoid the feeling of "floaty" jump/fall that is common in cheap old games. But was talking about horizontal inertia.

Van Daemos

Paragon (1954)

afbeelding van Daemos

04-05-2021, 15:57

yeah you mean the slipery sliding when landing? Yes I hate that too. A very veeery subtle slide is ok but making the character feel like its on ice is annoying.

Van santiontanon

Paragon (1524)

afbeelding van santiontanon

04-05-2021, 16:18

Yes, exactly! Again, I am not saying it is good or bad (I have nothing against complex physics in platformers), I am saying that the physics should go along with target gameplay. What I was disagreeing with is with the "we need to implement it to make it look professional", which seemed like the wrong reason haha Smile

Van Bengalack

Champion (419)

afbeelding van Bengalack

04-05-2021, 16:32

I have serious problems with spinning characters. I like responsiveness myself. Never liked the ice-stage in wonderboy, where this (naturally) is pretty extreme Big smile https://youtu.be/amRwK_KGj8c?t=1464

Van Daemos

Paragon (1954)

afbeelding van Daemos

04-05-2021, 16:54

exactly. Responsiveness and a great feel that fits the game itself. But all those great controls come with a great price and thats tons of cpu cycles Wink There more your character can do and the more responsive it needs to be the more rules need to be added up to a point where the phsysics easily eat up like 12 % of your cpu

Van Jaboody

Supporter (6)

afbeelding van Jaboody

04-05-2021, 19:50

For a lot of platformers, stuff like Spelunker, Montezuma's Revenge, even La-Mulana, precision controls without the player being a physics object is great, but moving a big Mario around the screen so carefully and taking into account his intertia to do so is just a great feeling as well, but typically the level design is a bit simpler to accommodate this, unless you're playing Mario Maker levels, in which case, all the rules get thrown out

Van albs_br

Champion (343)

afbeelding van albs_br

04-05-2021, 23:34

Regarding this subject (physics on platform games) I like this guide:
https://imgur.com/a/qfuZZ

Van ~mk~

Champion (303)

afbeelding van ~mk~

05-05-2021, 16:29

I think for platformers it is probably 50/50 (the games using complex vs simple physics).
It is definitely a matter of taste which you prefer, and I agree gameplay is quite different.
I grew up playing Wonderboy so it feels better when movement has inertia, but note that you can also move mid-air which is not real but gives you more control e.g. when you didn't measure your jump quite right, allowing you to survive if you react quickly.

For shoot'em ups, OTOH, it is probably 1/99, or even less. Actually, the only shmup that comes to mind right now with complex physics is Exerion, and it doesn't play wrong at all if you ask me. I think because you can move the ship in any direction (as opposed to platformers which are mostly 2d and movement is only left-right) it is that the difference in gameplay becomes more evident. So for shmups I think I prefer simple movement.

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