Open question to scene game piraters

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Por Timmy

Master (192)

imagem de Timmy

26-05-2017, 12:26

See it this way, I am still making games for the Spectrum scene, where people basically expect you to give away the games for free. At least in the MSX scene people are expected to get some money from it. That doesn't mean there won't be a lot of games getting released, it's just people are spending less time working on them. Or they try to monetise their products in other ways.

Secondly, if people are buying one (physical) copy and then share it around, then you should remember that this one physical copy is the only one that really has value. Make that physical copy to be the valuable one, and don't worry about being copied.

And Thirdly, if people want your game so bad they crowdfund for it on their own, why don't you help them by setting up a crowdfunding yourself? Saves them the work of crowdfunding, and you get your expected outcome (How much you expect from it, is up to you, of course.)

For me, it's just a hobby that costs money. So while I now can make games for the MSX (or other machines), it's just not my super top priority. Perhaps one day, though. Smile

Por JohnHassink

Ambassador (5605)

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26-05-2017, 12:26

Hrothgar wrote:

my programming skills never got any further than making Lingo in Basic

Well, that sounds pretty awesome to me. Smile Lingo rules!
I hope you don't think that I, or any other creator of MSX content is "in it for the money". Ofcourse I'm not. It's just that the piracy is signalling a message to me like: "We don't care how much time and effort was put in it. I'm a very speshul guy and so I'm entitled to have your stuff for free". It's not about getting rich, it's a matter of principle.

Por JohnHassink

Ambassador (5605)

imagem de JohnHassink

26-05-2017, 12:29

@ Timmy: But why should developers crowdfund anything, or make a special effort on top of creating something in the first place?

Por tfh

Prophet (3207)

imagem de tfh

26-05-2017, 12:35

JohnHassink wrote:

I like both analogies you make there, tfh. Good points. In the wake of teh internetz, I think a huge dent was made in the collective attention span, and the appreciation for "intellectual property", but God knows I was tape-trading heavy metal bands in the '80s.
On the other hand, I'm not sure if showing someone where to download Aleste 2 is the same as sharing a recent scene product.

Legally it's the same, but I understand that the "feeling" is different.


They said sometimes, piracy is what killed the home computer (or MSX), and what actually caused Japanese developers to focus on their native crowd, but I don't really believe that.

Cheaper PC's killed the homecomputer market...

Por ren

Paragon (1928)

imagem de ren

26-05-2017, 13:30

I actually wanted to address some matter before.
I recall a little while ago there was some uproar in a thread on DSK-PRO (really? Tongue Wink)
The author (cbsfox / Marcus Daniel Blanco) was allegedly involved in spreading still-sold stuff?
I remember Wouter (openMSX) was upset as well, as he shared knowledge with him to make DSK-PRO better, only to find out it to be used for the wrong reasons?

I also recall something about a facebook group administered by cbsfox (if I'm not mistaken) where this spreading took (or takes?) place? I tried to look that group up recently, but couldn't find it anymore (gone secret?)

(+ btw I remember to spot at least one (ATM rather inactive) MRC member registered to that group as well.)

I should be careful not to wrongly accuse someone, but some things do seem smelly, and I'd like to know if this matter concerning cbsfox has been resolved? (And what about this group (of his?)?)

(-edit I wonder if syn is referring to the same person btw?)

Por edoz

Prophet (2443)

imagem de edoz

26-05-2017, 13:16

I do not understand why this happens. I mean, is it so hard to pay something for the full version when you enjoyed the demo?
This is motivating people and the MSX community as well. To support the creators and your own hobby at the same time. Anyway it sucks that things like this happens.... I played the demo, of Tina, it was very cool to do! I was not planning to buy it, as i did some investments on CPC hardware lately... but after reading this story i will order one!

Por Hrothgar

Champion (479)

imagem de Hrothgar

26-05-2017, 14:13

JohnHassink wrote:

I hope you don't think that I, or any other creator of MSX content is "in it for the money". Ofcourse I'm not.

Oh, I wasn't thinking that you were, or that you weren't. I really don't care, and it's every programmer's right to choose his incentives and motivations. I just wanted to point out that I fear valuing honest purchases of your products (and subsequently getting sour if you see that's not always the case) might be a self-destructive mindset in this environment.

We've all seen this sort of discussion before and IMHO it all boils down to paying too much attention to what "other people" do or think. In various parts of life, I've come to learn that being able not to care what other people do or think is a great asset.

But feel free to disagree Wink

Por Grauw

Ascended (10604)

imagem de Grauw

26-05-2017, 14:58

Hrothgar wrote:

See this hobby as having a vegetable garden. You can have a great time throughout the year getting dirty hands and relaxing in it, and be rewarded by nature giving you a few tomatoes and some boerenkool once in a while. But if you expect it to earn or save you a lot of money or you know you'll be getting mad at the birds and snails for stealing part of your produce, then you can just as well not start such a hobby in the first place.

Wonderful analogy! Smile

JohnHassink, don’t let these people affect your enjoyment! They’re snails. For every one of them, there are a dozen other people that do appreciate your work so very much. Are you going to let those lowly snails cause harm to you and your fans? Big smile

@ren Until now no names have been called, let’s not start that please, the thread will turn sour within a second.

Por ren

Paragon (1928)

imagem de ren

26-05-2017, 16:02

@Grauw Not my intention to turn the discussion sour, but I do think sometimes you have to call a spade a spade isn't it?

It was just something I was wondering about, as there was some uproar, but it seemed just to be (conveniently?) forgotten / swept under the rug. If that person actually IS culprit, I feel MRC (and it's members) should be upset about that, take a stance, and remove him from the forums and ban/boycott his software (or at least he should explain himself..). If there's a rotten apple, it should be removed. There's enough controversy to raise some suspicion I guess. (And then at least we know who/what we're dealing with right?)

But again: I do like to tread carefully here. I only want to call spades spades (and now I'm the one doing it), and I feel we shouldn't be pussy / evasive about such a matter. Sharing some observations I made the last 0.5 yr or so.

Though it seems John has got his intel already(?) Perhaps he can react on this as well (as 'himself' and/or moderator of this site). (And perhaps Wouter (or someone else that was around) can share a thing or two to clear things up regarding this matter?)

Por syn

Prophet (2097)

imagem de syn

26-05-2017, 16:02

Yeah I meant the same guy , but I didn't know if it was the same person in this particular situation so I didn't wanted to mention a name.

Whoever it is in this case, doesn't really matter I guess. The problem is that it is still happening, and probably will happen until long after we are all gone. I think the goal of John is more of asking in general to all people who spread scene software, "Why are you trying to hurt the msx scene?" instead of pointing fingers to individuals.

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