Bad Apple for MSX please

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By wolf_

Ambassador_ (9892)

Аватар пользователя wolf_

29-01-2017, 09:21

Let's assume that there's 160 kb available for frames (the rest for code, music and that picture at the end). At the end of the C64-version there's been mentioned there are 2200 frames. 160000/2200 means ~72 bytes per frame on average. And this was about 12 frames per second, based on 2200 divided by roughly 180 seconds of animation time.

And while I didn't count accurately to the dot (the tiles aren't always regular enough to count 'm easily), I think this whole thing is a tilemap of 16x12 tiles (they're large tiles!). Now, 16x12 raw means 192 bytes. But as all the frames are sequential, you can assume that you only need to update the changed tiles.

A format for the tiles could be like this:

bit 7 = 0 -> bits 0-6 give you the tile number to draw
bit 7 = 1 -> bits 0-6 give you the number of tiles to skip

This way, you can plot loose tiles here and there, without wasting too much space.

This would imply that all the tiles would have to fit in a bank of 128. While 4motion did have a logical bank in which every colour combination was possible, it could be different for Bad Apple. You may design all kinds of arcs, triangles, straight lines etc. etc. run a matching function, see what's needed and leave out what's not really needed. Then you see whether you can replace a unique perfect match by an already existing nearly perfect match (this is where, visually, you get errors), until you end up with 128 tiles.

So, assume all of the above: is it possble to bring back a 192 bytes raw frame to an average of 72 bytes? I think it is. In many frames not much is changing, only the edges of a visual object, this can greatly bring down the required frame data.

And, who knows, they may be able to bring the average down even more, leaving room to upload unique tiles to their tile memory. Could be as easy as: If tile = 255 Then 'upload next 8 bytes' To 'tile location'.

By syn

Prophet (2064)

Аватар пользователя syn

02-03-2017, 14:00

Preview of a cover/remake of this song in Trilotracker FM that I have been working on for the last 2-3 weeks. Its about 25-30% done I think and I'm a bit bored with the project already so I'm unsure if I will ever finish it...

https://soundcloud.com/awct/bad-apple/s-XJSo9

By Manuel

Ascended (18126)

Аватар пользователя Manuel

02-03-2017, 21:14

Wow, I really like that cover! It's very atypical MSX-MUSIC music! Great rhythm section and very good sound choice! I really hope you'll finish it!

By sd_snatcher

Prophet (3470)

Аватар пользователя sd_snatcher

02-03-2017, 22:52

@syn

Loved it! Indeed very atypical.

BTW, I found a list of many Retro Bad Apples in YT! . It seems that the MSX version is still the only MIA there.

By kanima

Master (193)

Аватар пользователя kanima

02-03-2017, 23:01

syn wrote:

Preview of a cover/remake of this song in Trilotracker FM

quite enjoyable actually, hope you'll find the motivation to finish it

By Manuel

Ascended (18126)

Аватар пользователя Manuel

02-03-2017, 23:39

sd_snatcher wrote:

@syn

Loved it! Indeed very atypical.

BTW, I found a list of many Retro Bad Apples in YT! . It seems that the MSX version is still the only MIA there.

Louthrax already made it, check in previous page... Waiting for the finalized version, Louthrax!!

By sd_snatcher

Prophet (3470)

Аватар пользователя sd_snatcher

02-03-2017, 23:45

Louthrax wrote:

So this is a video I made with my own conversion tool chain (I just grabbed the video from youTube in MP4 format and launched the conversion). The generated "badapple.ad4" file is 35MB big, 8MB once zipped, the format I'm using has no compression at all. My replayer for these files is based on the EVA video format, but only works on MegaFlashROM SCC+ SD.

It seems very promising! But as Manuel said, it seems that the PAL vs NTSC speed is slowing it down.

Quote:

I'll publish a more polished version of the video. The sound needs to be normalized and cleaned a bit and a real black & white only palette should be used (the shown video was also using shades of gray which do not render super-well in this case).

I liked the shades of gray, since they're present in the original video too. The megadrive video preserved the shades of gray and seems to be the best version until now.

Quote:

Louthrax already made it, check in previous page... Waiting for the finalized version, Louthrax!!

Oh, yes! I meant a finalized version. Smile

By sd_snatcher

Prophet (3470)

Аватар пользователя sd_snatcher

03-03-2017, 00:01

By syn

Prophet (2064)

Аватар пользователя syn

03-03-2017, 00:12

sd_snatcher wrote:

BTW, I found a list of many Retro Bad Apples in YT! . It seems that the MSX version is still the only MIA there.

I have listened to them all :D The reason I started my cover was because I found so many versions but no MSX one.

sd_snatcher wrote:

Curiously enough, the original song really uses FM Synthesis.

I've read that too, but the dance version in those videoclips is a remix. the original Bad Apple!! is this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3kXx6f7qaa8 , although iirc the remix is based on a version of the song that appeared in another edition of Touhou.

Anyway thanks for the compliments guys :D

By raulsantacruz

Hero (594)

Аватар пользователя raulsantacruz

09-01-2018, 19:16

Hi,

It seems Yeongman Seo (http://sharksym.egloos.com/) make a full screen version with 12fps and original sound:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5920MuU9DQg

Amazing!!

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