PSG arrangements of 1980s SID game musics

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By JohnHassink

Ambassador (5591)

Аватар пользователя JohnHassink

25-01-2009, 19:39

I can follow your speculation.
Regarding MSX development, it must have been a totally different 'world' over there.

Most of us made games together with other people we met at fairs, etc.

Maybe there wasn't even a "scene" over there like we had in the other MSX countries.

If I'm not mistaken, Masahiro Ikariko was already a well-known synthesizer composer in Japan when he started to work for Konami.

And listen for instance to the music of HyDeFoS.
Ever gave me the idea that the composer probably didn't even like the FM-Pac that much, or its custom voices for that matter;
Most songs consist of 1 user generated instrument, simply used on 3 channels plus FM-drums.

So, if my hunch is true, definately not an "MSX freak" but an "outsider".

I always wondered how the professional Japanese game developers would attract sound and graphic artists;
Advertisements in the newspaper?
Some "portfolio database"?
Grew their own at a farm? Smile

By wolf_

Ambassador_ (9906)

Аватар пользователя wolf_

25-01-2009, 20:23

yea, just give'm water and they'll grow into fine composers Tongue

By ro

Scribe (4543)

Аватар пользователя ro

26-01-2009, 08:16

...while weeding out the bad plants, a genius jap dude thought "I'll ship'm to Europe and call them Wolfs".

By MäSäXi

Paragon (1884)

Аватар пользователя MäSäXi

26-01-2009, 12:33

I like arpeggios, by the way. Smile

And by the way, most of MSX´ers weren´t freaks who had FM-PACs and Moonsounds! Tongue But just 3 AY channels!

Still speculating about japanese composers, here´s what I think:

If you think they didn´t have too much Commodore 64s and Ataris etc there, that also means, that they didn´t have a chance to listen (european+american) game/demo music made using american machines which didn´t had AY. That way (at least not many) japanese PSG composers didn´t got new ideas how to make 3-channel computer music.

As always, there are always people who start to experiment with new ideas when they hear about them, no matter is it musical idea, furnituring idea, new kind of art, whatever. That´s why I think there should have been some "Commodore 64 style" music from japanese composers too, if they just had got more Commodore 64s there in the 1980s.

I wonder what may have been the market share of Commodore in eighties Japan?

Atari sold Atari 2600s in Japan.... don´t know nothing about american and european computers in Japan....

By Manuel

Ascended (18256)

Аватар пользователя Manuel

26-01-2009, 21:48

3 channel music: Ys series Smile

By JohnHassink

Ambassador (5591)

Аватар пользователя JohnHassink

27-01-2009, 11:53

3 channel music: Ys series Smile
I agree, the Ys series soundtracks are wonderful examples of efficient use of only 3 channels.

Significant of Ys music is the snaredrum (noise) and bass section sharing 1 channel.

For a different technique, I'd like to point out - just for instance- the Vampire Killer music.

The well-known (archetypic?) stage 1 to 3 music has the drums sharing a channel with the accompaniment, thus allowing the bassline to go all over the place as it is.
But listening plainly to it, you probably wouldn't even notice.
Simply brilliant! Smile

By MäSäXi

Paragon (1884)

Аватар пользователя MäSäXi

29-01-2009, 18:10

I downloaded Vortex Tracker II and randomly tried some files which came with it, and they worked.

Then I downloaded AY files from Project AY http://www.worldofspectrum.org/projectay/ and I tried several of them and none worked.... VT II always gives

Text Module Loader Error
Module not found (line: 1)

How can I load those AY tunes into Vortex Tracker II :-?

By JohnHassink

Ambassador (5591)

Аватар пользователя JohnHassink

30-01-2009, 00:29

How can I load those AY tunes into Vortex Tracker II Question
I don't think it supports those .ay files.

Probably best get one of those ay players from their site.

By MäSäXi

Paragon (1884)

Аватар пользователя MäSäXi

30-01-2009, 10:26

I already have fine Ay emulator, which can be found from Nyyrikki´s link, and ALL those .ay files are working fine with it, but I want to listen all those tunes on my MSX2, not just through PC´s horribly speakers. That´s why I like to get them converted to pt3.

But there was (at least one) .ay files (in fuxoft folder) which came with Vortex Tracker II, how that .ay differs from other .ay files which I downloaded from Project AY? Question

How I can convert those "non-working" .ay files to pt3 if Vortex Tracker II don´t support them...? As most tunes which come with Vortex Tracker II are something horrible to my musical taste... Wink

Also, is there a way to convert 48K beeper tunes (which are already made to .ay files by some spectrum lover) to form which is readable by real MSX? I am not expecting accurate conversion, tune which somewhat resembles 48K beeper original is fine to me. Smile

As those 48K beepers are already .ay files, I guess there should be a way to make them work in MSX too, in theory at least.....

Please help!

By factor6

Supporter (4)

Аватар пользователя factor6

03-02-2009, 13:49

Hi MSXers Smile

I read your discussion on AY theme and maybe I could help you with some info as I am active Speccy user with interest in tracker music making.
.AY format is just a data dump from the PSG, it can't be loaded into Vortex Tracker. That's why .AY can contain any of Spectrum sound output, even beeper music.

If you want to convert tracks from Speccy, look for .PT3, .STC and .SQT formats. These formats are compilates from specific trackers (PT3 = ProTracker3, STC = old Polish Soundtracker, SQT = SQ-Tracker). Look at bulba.untergrund.de for quite big AY archive. The format of all these files is similar and contains a player and packed data.

These files can be played back on the Spectrum with this tool: http://matt.west.co.tt/music/tracker2ay/
I think it will be easy job to convert it to MSX as both computers have same CPU.

Concerning SID vs AY music from games, there are more versions of Commando (for example) on Speccy. That one by Fuxoft was the first one (he was one of the first AY music composers here in Czech Republic, developed his own editor (not tracker) so his musics are quite unique). There are two other Commando covers, one is in some old Polish demo and the other is Russian. The most of C64 classic tunes have been covered on Speccy. I did some covers, too. Look at my archive at http://factor6.ic.cz

I really don't know if beeper tunes stored as .AY dump could work on AY chip. We're investigating it right now with our friends. Theoretically it's possible. Beeper can be emulated even on Atari XL/XE's keyboard-control chip :) Look here: http://atarionline.pl/v01/index.phtml?subaction=showfull&id=1227605419&archive=&start_from=&ucat=1&ct=nowinki (it's in Polish but you can use google translator).

Cheerz

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